THE WHITE HOUSE
Office of the Press Secretary
March 22, 2001PRESS BRIEFING BY ARI FLEISCHER
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Q The expulsion of the Russian diplomats is a Cold War-scale action, only paralleled by President Reagan's order in '86. So we must assume only a Cold War-scale espionage operation could warrant such an action. Is that truly what the President thinks, that the Russians went back to Cold War espionage activity, and that would be the reason for the action against them?
MR. FLEISCHER: The action reflects the President's approach to foreign policy, and to relations with Russia, which is an approach that is going to be based on mutual cooperation, finding areas of agreement and broadening them, but also based on realism. And that's why the President authorized the State Department to take the step that it took last night. The President believes it's the right thing to do, and that's why he took that step in this post-Cold War era.
Q How does the President see Russia now? Is Russia becoming a threat to the U.S. again?
MR. FLEISCHER: The President believes that there are many areas where we could cooperate with Russia. And he has spoken with President Putin about such areas and will continue to do so. But there are areas where there are disagreements. Clearly, this is one of them. And the President took the appropriate action.
Q Ari, when was the President notified about the matter? When did he authorize the State Department to take this action?
MR. FLEISCHER: Kelly, almost immediately upon the arrest of Agent Hanssen, the President discussed with his national security team at that time what possible remedies and consequences could be. So at that moment, the President was already thinking about what the appropriate step to take was. He continued to have conversations with his national security team about the matter following the arrest.
And then last week his national security team made a recommendation to him. The President gave the go-ahead last week. Secretary Powell met with Russian officials last night, as you know, and that's when the action was informed -- that's when the Russians became informed of the action. The President authorized it last week.
Q Do you expect retaliatory action by the Russians?
MR. FLEISCHER: I think you have to ask the Russians that.
Q But you have no intimation of that now, no U.S. diplomats have been asked to leave as of now?
MR. FLEISCHER: That's a question you would have to ask the Russians. The United States has not been notified of any such action.
Q How much of this was aimed at people who were directly involved with Hanssen, and how much of it is a broader move? And can you explain what the broader move -- the significance of the broader move would be?
MR. FLEISCHER: The State Department addressed that earlier this morning in their announcement. They noted that the action and the expulsion of four Russian intelligence officers who have been declared persona non grata. It followed the arrest on February 18th, 2001, of FBI Special Agent Robert Hanssen on charges of espionage on behalf of the Soviet Union and the Russian Federation.
Q You're saying those four were directly involved in espionage with Hanssen?
MR. FLEISCHER: That's correct.
Q What about the rest of the Russian diplomats who are being asked to leave?
MR. FLEISCHER: Well, as you know, the United States government for many years has expressed its concern to the Russians about the level and the number of Russian intelligence officers operating in the United States, and we have addressed those concerns to the Russians.
Q When was the last time the President spoke with Putin, and what kind of contacts have they held in the past few months?
MR. FLEISCHER: He spoke on the phone with President Putin a number of weeks ago, and of course, we are always in diplomatic touch with the Russians.
Q Don't you think that a situation like this would merit another contact?
MR. FLEISCHER: Clearly, the President did not think that was necessary. The President took the action he thought appropriate.
Q What's the overall benefit of something like this? We know that they spy on us; they know that we spy on them. When you make a dramatic move like asking more than 40 diplomats/intelligence agents to leave, it's a diplomatic move meant to send a message that will affect Russian-U.S. relations. What's the purpose? What's the goal?
MR. FLEISCHER: The action is a reflection of the President's approach to foreign policy and to dealing with Russia, which is we are going to find areas of cooperation -- the President is going to continue to pursue areas of cooperation; he sees many. But the President also is going to be a realist in the conduct of his foreign policy. And in the wake of what happened with Agent Hanssen and the Russian involvement, the President made the determination that it is in the United States' interest to declare the four Russian intelligence officers persona non grata.
Q Why was it in our best interest, and what is the message you're sending by doing it?
MR. FLEISCHER: The message the President is sending is that his foreign policy is going to be based on reality. He's going to have a realistic approach to foreign policy.
Q Isn't espionage real -- a reality we face in the early 21st century?
MR. FLEISCHER: And the reaction from the President is realistic, based on conducting foreign affairs in a realistic -- and you have heard the President say this many times before -- realistic and direct way. He's a plainspoken man.
Q Ari, just to get it from your mouth, please -- could you please give us a summary of how many were expelled altogether, how many have left -- and what's the deadline for the others?
MR. FLEISCHER: As announced earlier this morning by the State Department, four Russians were declared persona non grata, and other concerns have been expressed about the level of intelligence officers in this country.
Q But we're not giving the number -- 51, 56 -- it keeps getting batted around.
MR. FLEISCHER: I've just answered the question.
Q What are the concerns about potential retaliation, since we apparently have fewer people on the ground in Russia than they had here?
MR. FLEISCHER: Again, that's asking me to speculate about a future event, and I'm not going to do that. We don't know if that will or will not take place, and I won't speculate.
Q Can you give us a little tick-tock? When did the President become informed of the recommendation? Who made the recommendation to him? And who was it that told the Russians that these folks were no longer invited into our country?
MR. FLEISCHER: The conversations were held with the President and his national security team, and I believe -- you might want to talk to the State Department about it -- my understanding was in a meeting last night with Secretary Powell.
Q That was the answer to the last question, Powell talked to the Russians?
MR. FLEISCHER: To the Russians.
Q Who all -- was there one meeting at which x-number of aides made the recommendation to the President? When was his meeting? Who was in on it?
MR. FLEISCHER: Let me try to find out additional details if I can, Ron.
Q He did sign off on it personally?
MR. FLEISCHER: Last week. He authorized it last week.
Q If you could find out details on that meeting, I'd appreciate it.
Q Can you confirm how many have actually left?
MR. FLEISCHER: I would refer you to the State Department for those types of details.
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Q Can I go back to the spying, the expulsions. You said that we've made representations to the Russians for a long time about the level of espionage, the level of people engaged in these activities.
MR. FLEISCHER: That's correct.
Q Are you saying today that the Bush administration is not going to tolerate the level that was tolerated in the prior administration?
MR. FLEISCHER: I'm making clear that the President has made clear that we have concerns about the level of Russian intelligence officers in this country.
Q And that is because they are a friendly nation, they shouldn't -- the Cold War is long over?
MR. FLEISCHER: Because in the wake of the arrest of agent Hanssen and the evidence that has developed in that case, the President took the appropriate action based on his concerns about the number of Russian intelligence officials in this country.
Q Ari, the President's decision last week to approve this, was that more of a general decision agreeing to the expulsion recommendation, or did he get down into, this number of people should go?
MR. FLEISCHER: No, there was some specific back-and-forth conversations between the President's national security team and the President, and as with any decision the President makes, whether it's domestic or foreign policy, he enjoys a back-and-forth conversation with his advisors and he reaches a conclusion and announces it.
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Q Is there an assumption that every Russian diplomat is a spy?
MR. FLEISCHER: No.
Q I'm just trying to put together the pieces of the reality that you are talking about, the administration's perception of Russia. Russia is being called an active proliferator. The President's budget is cutting back on the financial aid to Russia. Russia was mentioned in the President's interview to the New York Times, a bad environment for investments. And now we have the expulsion of 50 or so diplomats. So that's what the Russians called a Cold War mentality, or most analysts here would say, a hard-line approach to Russia.
MR. FLEISCHER: I think you're going to see the President's approach to Russia be exactly as I indicated earlier. The President sees avenues of cooperation with Russia. The President sees opportunities for trade with Russia, for increasing help with democratization inside Russia. The President also sees disagreements, and the President will have a foreign policy with Russia that is realistic and takes those disagreements into account, as well as the areas of agreement.
Q Ari, there's a Russian official quoted today in the Russian press as saying that Russian retaliation for this expulsion would involve hundreds -- plural -- hundreds of American diplomats. And this official noted that there are many more American diplomats in Moscow than there are Russian diplomats in Washington. In light of that threat, and in light of those numbers, is there some concern in the administration that this may be counterproductive in the end; if we get into a game of tit-for-tat in expulsions, that the United States may be the loser?
MR. FLEISCHER: Again, I'm not going to speculate about any events that have not taken place. But I want to reiterate, the President took this action because he thought it was in the national interest in the wake of a very serious espionage matter involving matters of American national security. It was the right thing to do, and that is why he did it.
Q Well, is it true that we have hundreds more?
MR. FLEISCHER: That's a question you need to ask the State Department. I don't keep track of the number of our diplomats around the world.
Q You're not going to leave a statement out like that, are you?
MR. FLEISCHER: I don't keep track of the number of our diplomats around the world.
Q There's an amendment added to the campaign finance bill that would assist candidates facing very wealthy opponents. Does the White House support that?
MR. FLEISCHER: Let me do this. Are there any more on Russia? We'll finish that and then come back to that. Be happy to.
Jim and then Kelly.
Q You say that the President's policy towards Russia is one of realism.
MR. FLEISCHER: Correct.
Q You seem to be suggesting that this is a shift from the previous administration policy.
MR. FLEISCHER: The President is not interested in making comparisons. He's interested in looking forward and designing a realistic foreign policy around the world that represents America's best interests. And that's why he has taken this action. I'll leave it to others the matter of comparisons.
Q The U.S. has complained for some time about the fact that there were a larger number of Russian intelligence agents here than they preferred. Has it gotten worse, or did the President -- what prompted the President to ask so many other Russian diplomats to leave?
MR. FLEISCHER: Well, again, the President has expressed, the State Department has expressed concern about the level of Russian intelligence officers in this country. But it's just a reminder that even in the post-Cold War era, situations like this arise, and the President will treat them seriously and deal with them realistically.
Q But the State Department had complained a year or two ago. There have been officials complaining quietly for at least two or three years about this. I'm trying to figure out why the President decided this was the time not just to respond to the Hanssen case, but to also ask some 40 other diplomats to leave.
MR. FLEISCHER: I can only address the announcement that the President and the State Department made this morning about the decision to expel four Russians as persona non grata.
Q So this is really a two-part action then. One is to get people out who were actually dealing with Hanssen. The other is to send the Russians a message that we're not going to allow that many intelligence agents to operate inside the U.S.
MR. FLEISCHER: I think I've already addressed it.
Q Just following that, can you shed any more light on what the recommendation from the President's national security team was, in fact? Was it to expel only those related to Hanssen, or was it broader?
MR. FLEISCHER: Kelly, it's my policy only to discuss the items that the President has acted on. And any conversations that were internal I'm going to leave internal. And don't take that to mean that there was anything else suggested or recommended. The President took the action that he took, and that's what I'm discussing.
Q Ari, how much damage do you think you've done to their intelligence apparatus with this move?
MR. FLEISCHER: That's not an assessment for me to make.
Q But your response to several questions here has been to imply that the previous administration has allowed in too many intelligence agents?
MR. FLEISCHER: No, I'm just pointing out the historical accuracy of the fact that expressions of concern about the level of Russian intelligence officers in the United States is not new. I think many people in this room know that; many people who have covered the State Department know that. It's not meant to compare. It's just an accurate reflection of a fact that this government has been grappling with for considerable time.
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